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Way too many variable. Was meant as something else to consider, not an arguement. If it came across that way, my apologies. You're pretty much dead on on the pat downs. Usually suspected something. When I started and up until I went to Street crimes, Special Operations and Motors, I worked a lot of remote area. Far east side of our county, and the most remote reaches both north and south. They didn't call it "Fort Lonesome" for nothing:) As a Deputy Sheriff, our closest backup was sometimes 30 minutes or more away...if there was one at all. YOu had to rely on your instincts and training, and a good does of BS and luck didn't hurt either;) Take care and stay safe:thumbsup: |
If you ignore what the sign says, good luck...Remember that you are on their property...
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I guess I've just never fully understood this concept of "private" state property. After all, who provides the money for the purchase and maintenance of such properties? So the bigety wigeties in state government can use OUR money to buy these private playgrounds for their own private use and tell us unwashed masses to keep our grubby paws out? Or make stipulations about how WE can utilize the land but they are exempt from those same regulations? I can understand if it's some high security records storage facility of some sort, but raw undeveloped land?
I guess the people that make the rules can make whatever rules they pretty damn well want to..... :shrug01: |
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Unless I'm in a place that specifically prohibits carry, like a bar, I'm packen. If I'm patted down or searched that's when the attorney takes over. |
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This is nothing new... Quote:
As such, they make the rules for it's use. As we've seen with Federal lands, the rules have changes for those licensed to carry:thumbsup: If the state can't see fit to follow suit, then I'll just avoid thier land. Chances are very good that this will never be an issue for those of us here. Quote:
It just depends. You can be patted down for just about any reason. Most of the time, we're going to say our safety and that of the citizen (so we know you're not going for a knife or other weapon later). Probably BS, but it'll hold up in court;) As for the attorney, there's still that whole, bookiing, mug shot, bail and bunking with bubba for the evening thing that you have to get past first.:lmao: I'll pass:D |
First thing I'm going to say is "what sign". Second thing I'm going to say is "illegal search". Just between us they are not going to deprive me my right to self defense. You know me and I am a law abiding citizen and also have the utmost respect for law enforcement but I'm carrying, screw the sign, end of story.
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They're not the same and do not require the same level of probable cause. As a matter of fact, a pat down, doesn't require PC at all. Quote:
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They indicated that another person (Mike) called and spoke with thier legal hounds yesterday. I assume it was our Mike, but I haven't seen a response on the board. Mr. Miller forwarded a copy of the email response provided in reference to Mike's request (redacted). We all wen't round and round for quite some time, and I found them to be very helpful, polite and patient when dealing with a citizens request.:thumbsup: So, in response to the above two (2) quotes: Quote:
Considering all they have to do to amend the rules, public notice process, legislative sessions, the house.....blah blah blah, it'll be at least 1.5 years before this gets changed. That said, they are aware of the rule, are being pro-active :thumbsup::hurray:, working to amend thier rules. As for the property in question, I spoke with Karen about that particular piece of land. It appears it borders the WMD land and that there is a public access road that runs between one property and the management area. A long as you are on the road, you're golden! Step off the road, and you're illegal. One other point is, where in many cases, WMD and WMA (Wildlife Management Areas) overlap, WMA rules override WMD. You really want to be careful there. As for this and many other WMD only controlled properties, my "guess" would be, and it's nothing more than that, a guess, "if" you were caught on thier property doing nothing more than traversing it, had no other issues and were up front and professional with the security person or LEO, nothing would happen other than to tell you "you can't do that for now" and ask you to quietly leave the property. But I wouldn't bet my license on it;) BTW-For the record, they use off duty FWC officers (who better to patrol the "woods":thumbsup:) for property security and rule enforcement. A little research goes a long way toward making a sound and reasonable decision. Hope some of this helps. GB |
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1. Thanks for all of the research. :thumbsup: 2. Didn't know it wasn't considered a "search". 3. I agree that everyone needs to be respectful. 4. I am going to carry regardless. :D |
If "patting down" is not considered a search, then what is the PURPOSE of it? Just some friendly hands on contact between one consenting adult and the other not so consenting? :rolleyes:
I know it is claimed that it is for the safety of the officer(s), but seriously when does the concern for officer safety trump constitutionally guaranteed protections for us citizens? Sounds to me that "UP" is simply being redefined as "DOWN" just to conveniently bypass our legal rights concerning searches and seizures. |
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