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It appears that anyone with an opinion is biased. |
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Let's not turn another thread into a pissing contest:( There are other forums more suitable for that:D:yesnod: Quote:
Here, let me do it for you. Maybe this will clear the air, the other members (not like they'll particularly care:hehehe:) will know the truth, and maybe, just maybe all the innuendo, supposition and cryptic commentary can cease and we can go back to being the somewhat dysfunctional family we've always been? Ok, ready? Here it comes! (drum roll please)........ .....It's as simple as this: About a year ago, Bob started working with my company, heading up a Florida East Coast operation that I'm attempting to get off the ground. A whole lot of busy work and not a lot of $$$ flow at the moment, but I pray that changes shortly. ok....that's it.:D The cat's out of the bag. Now maybe everyone can breathe a bit easier knowing the numbers to the secret decoder ring:hehehe: Quote:
Do you really believe we're all in collusion against you? If that's the case, we might want to keep an eye on that new C6Flatfoot character too;) I mean after all, he's a LEO, he did post just after Bob posted the thread, and a little before me, and he's at least in the same geographical area as Bob! I think Rockets' comment: Quote:
I'd like to know too? Why continue to lash out and make snide comments? As for the topic, it was Bob's choice. I had nothing to do with it and no prior knowledge. It's simple. For whatever reason, Bob posted a legitmate question in the form of a thread. He placed the thread in the correct location, didn't point fingers, and left it open ended, requesting our opinions on the matter. Rocket would have had no way of knowing (or reason to believe) that Bob had any other "motive" than to ask a question and await a response. If nothing else, it's traffic:thumbsup: There really doesn't need to be a "motive" behind everything. I'm not sure how you came about the conclusion that "it (who is "it" BTW?) brought the topic" from another thread? You're claiming that "someone brought the topic" here. Isn't that what the board is for? Topics? To clear the air even more, Bob doesn't consult me on non-work related matters.And he danged sure doesn't consult me prior to posting! He has this thing called...uh, what was it? Oh yea, FREE WILL, which in theological terms is simply the ability to make ones own decisions and screwup at will:D As for my response, it was just that, a response. Nothing more "sinister" than that. Just my "opinion" on privacy matters. The way it works for me these days, is I log in, hit "new posts", check out the board for anything I want to respond to, then log off and go back to work. I no longer remain logged in 24/7. In this one, after quite a bit of thought, I gave him my "opinion" on the matter and left it at that. I even considered not posting in the thread at all because I was afraid my appearance there might lead to just this sort of response. It was you that responded, totally off topic, with the "lockstep" remark. Was it necessary? For the record, when Bob and I do have conversations, they generally go something like this: I contact him when we have work in the area, and he contacts me with problems. I contact him with legal matters and policy changes, and he complies. Pretty simple. He contacts me with questions and I provide answers. Other than that, our conversations generally hinge on business growth and marketing....pretty heady stuff right there:lmao: So to imply that there's any collusion between Bob and myself, or any other member of this website, for any ulterior motive, is pure nonsense! It's simply not happening. Thanks for listening. |
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We have met twice. Once for a business meeting and once at the 'Meet & Greet' for Andy. I do not cal you to discuss anything I'm going to post and when I do post it's my opinion and my opinion only. We've also had a couple of major pizzing contests concerning business but like most people do we've mended our fences and have a closer bond because it enabled us to understand each other better. Will we have more? Maybe. Will we work through it. Definitely Let me sum up with a story I have heard. I knew a guy that had to quit going to football games. Every time they got in a huddle he thought they were talking about him. |
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OK, so now that you guys have laid out your "facts", let me add another one. Quote:
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If anyone is willing and able to put 2 and 2 together, then please do so. Those who are unwilling or unable to do so, well, that sort of leaves you still in the dark I guess. Sorry about that, but the picture is here, in my opinion, if you care to look. Seriously guys, I don't care what you do, but I believe HOW you are doing it is really not all that "friendly" now is it? As I have mentioned, I have watched this sort of dance before and the dropped hints that were thought to be inside jokes at my expense really weren't as "inside" as you thought. I knew what was going on, just needed some confirmation. Did you really think that I was too stupid to know what you were up to and referring to with your innuendos? Yeah, I know, I was just being paranoid and too sensitive to remarks made........ :rolleyes: Good luck with your new site, fellas. But please keep in mind that I am under no obligation to help you in any way or allow you the use of this site in that manner. And a friendly word of advice. Do NOT give me even the slightest excuse to ban the both of you. I hope I don't need to explain that... Most other admins would have banned you LONG ago for a whole lot less. And any belittlement either actual or implied towards me or this site from either of you will get deleted along with you being escorted out the door. Peace, "my friends" and " my brothers"....... :wavey: |
We are laying the ground work for a Muscle Car site and it has nothing to do with Corvettes. The reason for contacting the other guy was to see if he wanted to advertise his services (free) and bring in new members from that category, of which none post in this forum.
So where is the problem? Where is the conflict? Thanks for the info. |
:dancer01: Dayamm, I guess I am a behind the times person, I would have never thought there was so much money to be made off a website !!
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If you create a new message board site competing with one or more already well established ones in the same field of interest, unless you have a unique attraction to draw members into the site, or throw a LOT of money into advertising, your chances of surviving as a money making business are very, very slim. Some owners of brand new websites will sometimes try to take shortcuts to try to gain the momentum needed to get their site going. Along those lines, I have had some interesting discussions with people who ran gecko message board sites (reptile stuff) and I was astonished at the things people would do to try to destroy their competition to get that leg up they need. Believe me I paid attention and learned a LOT from people who actually engage in that sort of thing. One of the primary tools is to try to make the membership disgruntled with the management of their target. Constantly nipping at the heels of the moderators and admin till they got themselves banned, and afterwards either their partners or themselves in fake registrations would try to raise a ruckus about freedom of speech and the heavy handed tactics of the management there is a very popular tactic. Somehow the "fact" that a new site out there has much better management will wind up in those conversations. :rolleyes: Someone very good at this sort of tactic can be VERY effective and hard to counter. If the management simply bans all of those rabble rousers, how would it look? If they were left to continue with the sniping, then management looks like it is ineffective and lacks the will to control it's own site. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. But realistically grabbing the nettle and tugging hard is really the only solution. Unfortunately, there is a lot of this going on. I'm sure the bigger Corvette sites have had their share of this sort of thing, as nearly every other interest field I have been into seems to suffer from it. I have been on gun sites that you could tell got beat up terrible in webwars of this nature. There was one site that completely closed down because of it when the admin got fed up and just walked away. We're talking about a site that had MILLIONS of posts and over 100K registered members. So obviously I keep a wary eye out on all my sites with this all in mind. I am not nearly that naive to believe I am immune to this sort of thing. But I do tend to give people a lot more rope than a lot of other admins will do in cases like this. The days of someone simply setting up a message board site and people flocking to it are simply over with. Message boards are a dime a dozen these days and anyone can set one up virtually overnight. Getting TRAFFIC is the problem, and also the key to surviving. Most will fail, simply because of the extremely tough hurdle of traffic NEEDS traffic to get established. This is an extremely tough nut to crack. Honestly, if this site had been set up as a business, it would already be considered a failure. But that is not my goal. Some people believe they could make it so, and have wanted me to make it that way, but I declined, knowing the odds of success were too slim to make the effort and shatter the already slim margin of survival that exists. Why set a target that you know you will likely never hit? I guess some people are just way more ambitious than I am and believe they know a whole lot more about this sort of thing than I do. Well good luck to you in that endeavor. I hope this all proves worthwhile to you. As for everything going on, I do apologize that this all is being aired publicly. I think it would have been difficult to do this privately without bringing up a lot more questions and confusion, all things considered. Plus my hand was really being forced, and I had really hoped my suspicions, although pretty strong, were entirely unfounded. This site will still be here with or without certain persons. As has been mentioned, the internet is big enough for a lot of sites. I imagine traffic here will take a nosedive for a while, but that's OK. I'm not counting on income from this site, so that really has no effect on my bottom line nor the driving force for me to have this site here. I got rid of my secondary server and found pretty good quality hosting for a very reasonable price, so things are working out just fine in that department. Costs here are minimal, all things considered. Things will get better...... |
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So once again, where is the problem? Where is the conflict? I have countless times tried to explain a different point of view but you have a one track mind and refuse to accept my views. Now if this a troublesome post for you go ahead and delete it and ban me. I am not going to walk through here on tip toes. |
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Just facts and opinions. Quote:
I already know who it is. He was actually someone I suggested contacting if/when we decided to set something up. Why? Because when I spoke with him at the HOOTERS SHOW ON GANDY, he was talking about wanting to get more involvement in the show from the local "muscle car" and "hot rodder crowd. Since I know a lot of these folks, and am setting this up primarily for THEM, I thought, what better place for him to place some more free advertising? This would be in addition to his advertising here. He could gain additional exposure to those who might need tuning in or near the Tampa area as well as maybe gain the attention of those he was looking to attract. Nothing here would change! I'm not sure why he felt the need to run to you with the information? But that's his perogative. I do apologize for trying to help a "brother" out. I can assure you, it won't happen again! Quote:
(I'll get more into that in a moment.) Quote:
Actually Rich, you've DANCED this dance before:yesnod: It'll be more evident when you read the final part of my post. Quote:
You know me well enough (or maybe you don't?) to know that I'm pretty straight forward. You claim to "call a spade a spade." I simply call it a f**king shovel! Quote:
You're so far off in left field, it's not funny. You only "know" what you think you know, and believe what your suspicions allow you to believe. Those suspicions are running off good people:( Once again, there were no "innuendos" on my part. If I had something to say, I'd have said it! Quote:
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Not that you're going to believe anything anyone else tells you, but for the record: 1) As I've stated in a previous post, NOTHING had been started" prior to your taking action against me, then accusing me of some sort of "rogue mod", terroristic acts nonsense! At that point, the "family feeling" that was once here, vanished for me:( If it were not for my friends here, and my interest in the Corvette, I'd have left then. 2) I don't control Bob! I didn't tell him or anyone else to contact anyone, PERIOD! I'm not sure why I'm even bothering to tell you this, but, there was a brief conversation about starting up a "General Muscle Car" site aimed at the Florida based owner and enthusiast. When I found out that Phil had been contacted, I told Bob that I'd talk with PPhil at the next Hooters show. Again, this was to assist him in promoting his show, as well as help us get the site off the ground, and not "steal" him from your site. 3) This was NEVER supposed to be a commercial venture, and it was NEVER considered to be a replacement for nor competition to, this site. 4) It's a place to hang out. A lot of my friends have Street rods, customs, other make/model muscle cars, and I thought, WTF? Why not open up a board for them? And with a grandaughter in the house, it's likely my next muscle car will have 4 seats. Unless the vette changes drastically, it probably won't fit the bill. The new (and old) Mustangs are sweet, as are the 70's model Camaros. The new 'Stang are easy to make handle and perform (in thier own right). The older Camaros and Mustangs, Mopars and such can go either way. Old school, ugly, gas eatin', fire breathing 4 MPG'ers, or out in some late model running gear and suspension and go have some fun:dancer01: Since it won't be a daily driver, a lot of what we look for in the Vette, won't really matter. Hell, several people here have both a corvette and another muscle car, hot rod, truck or other American vehicle. 5) I liked the concept of a regional forum or board, following your lead. I guess the whole "immitation is the best form of flattery" thing was lost on you, huh? And I like the idea that as some of us have actually done recently and in the past, we can get together on occasion, have dinner, hang out, talk about cars, work on cars or WTF ever? The next thing I know, Bob's getting back to me with a link to a new site. I'm like damn dude! I don't have time for this right now, I'll look at it later! I knew I wanted something that was easy to remember, easy to say, and relatively easy to type. I wanted it Domestic only, regional to Florida, and open to anyone that had an interest:thumbsup: [b]Most of all, I wanted to avoid any indication that I was out to "compete" this site! FYI- I know crap about running a website. But if you did it, I'll bet I can learn;) And the only thing that had anything to do with you or this site, is that had you not gone completely off the deep end with your suspicions and allegations, accusing me (in an offhanded fashion) of trying to destry the site:rolleyes: the impetus for the other board may still have been in the background. I would like to thank Phil (Tampa Tuning) also. Had he not mentioned that he wanted to attract more of a variety of muscle cars and rods to the show, the thought may have never entered my mind. So, thanks to both of you for the motivation:thumbsup: All that other crap you were rattling off that a "rogue mod" might do, is just so much bunk and as I said before, has never crossed my mind. Most of what you were worried about, to me seems so aggregious that I simply would never consider it. Maybe it's the "cop" left in me? Another point: The new site was never mentioned to you (or anyone else other than 2 people) because: 1) It's none of your business (I knew how you'd react) 2) It's NOT YET PUBLIC:lmao: When it was time, I'd release it. Bob's involvement in the new site was not a planned event. It was mentioned in passing and the next thing I know, shazam! there it was:lmao: So there you have it. The not so short story of the new domestic muscle car site here in Florida. Quote:
You of all people should under stand that (refer to the PM). Quote:
well, before you go getting all "glass house" on me for something I haven't done, you might want to do a little reading of your own: Since it's now apparently ok to share Private Messages with the rest of the world, here's a little PM you sent me back when: I haven't changed a thing but have taken the liberty to underline the pertinent segments I know you told me a while back that DigitalCorvettes would likely allow me to reopen my account with them, so I sent them off an email last night. Here's the response I got.. Quote: ----- Original Message ----- From: "sitesupport" <sitesupport@digitalcorvettes.com> To: "Rich Z" <rich@corvetteflorida.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 11:53 AM Subject: Re: I'm confused.... > If you're confused about the difference between 'soliciting' and > 'involving others', nothing I'll say will clear your vision. > > Clubs can become active within DC, but it's simply not for channeling > advertisement to their site. > > We take disabling an account serious; I can assure you that we won't > change our minds on a decision you made. > > Rich Z wrote: >> A long while back I was banned from your site, I assume because you >> considered my CorvetteFlorida.com website as being a threat to yours >> somehow. My site is focused on Florida Corvette owners and a pretty >> narrow focus at that. Yet you have a section on DigitalCorvettes >> where you actively solicit input and info from and about regional and >> local clubs, many with their own websites. >> >> So I'm trying to reconcile the conflict here and having difficulty.>> >> If you still insist on keeping my login of "Rich Z" banned, well >> that's up to you. But seems rather ridiculous if you ask me.... The >> Hotel California approach has never really worked all that well on the >> Internet. >> >> Rich Zuchowski >> rich@CorvetteFlorida.com >> http://www.CorvetteFlorida.com >> >> I still think they are pricks........... __________________ ‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’ Pricks? Why? For banning you for mining thier members? You think it's ok to ask someone to come over here, yet it's taboo for me or anyone else to inviote someone to anther site? Heck! We even allow links to other sites here. And please let me point out that in the above letter, there seems to be some confusion over the term "soliciting." I guess you called it "involving?" Isn't that exactly what we were doing with Phil? Trying to "involve him" and his business so he can build it? I don't know nor do I care, if he's a paid sponsor or not. He wouldn't be on the other site. Id just be another way for him to get exposure and get his name out there. Yet you now take a dim view of the action:shrug01: There also seems to be some confusion between the definition of a "club" and a "website?" As a computer person, I'd have thought at would be exceedingly clear to you? Of course, maybe it was the last paragraph that did you in? Coming off like that, I can't say I blame them for thier decision. It's as though you're "telling" them what they should do. Quote:
Slow steady growth is a good thing in my book. Since I'm not looking at it commercially, it really doesn't matter. Hopefully we're broad based enough to generate some activity. Quote:
You may recall one Pewter99 who did just that. He was a mod here for a brief time, came over from brand X (Corvette Forum). Started bitching right off the bat about the "lack of moderation" on the site and the laid back attitude. I guess it wasn't his cup o' tea. He left then came back with several screen names and tried to start dissention. I took care of that problem for you. Quote:
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A long as I'm not spending inordinate amounts of $$ and not taking food off my friends tables, what can it hurt? You've said it yourself. The internet is a big place. Quote:
Your site and say Corvetteforum or Digital Corvettes, are in totally different worlds. Both of those are commercial and depend on traffic to get and keep thier sponsors. Here, sponsorship is free and you can advertise at will. It's a great thing you're doing, especially for a start up business, but with the limited viewer base and traffic (not a slam, just a fact), it gives no incentive to a business to pay for advertising space here. Quote:
If not, I apologize. If so, I don't claim to know what you know. I do however, know that I'm intelligent enough to learn. Quote:
And no, this didn't have to be aired in public. You chose to place it there. Why attempt to make it appear that you had no choice? Quote:
This is the kind of thing that hurts the most. For whatever reason, you suddenly turned on those that have tried to help you? "certain persons?" Hell Richard, you even have my phone number. But to refer to me as "certain persons?" Jeez! Quote:
I'd like to see the 2 sites do some things together. There's enough "my this" and "my that" to go around:rolleyes: If the performance community doesn't start focuing more on unity, we're not going to have one. Quote:
Oh, and BTW-jsut to prove my point that I have tried to assist growth in this forum at my own risk. Here's another PM you and I shared some time back: Quote:
Yeah, that was me "inviting" some Florida members over to check out the site. You wern't too upset about that were you? FWIW- I've had this sites sig on several sites I've been on with absolutely not repercussions. Others, such as CF and DC, I know better. As for your threat to delete and ban.....Again, I'm not at all sure why you feel the need to trheaten any of us with banning for speaking our mind professionally, supported by evidence.? Threatening to delete anything that you disagree with (under the guise of dissention) just doesn't seem like the thing to do? You could have picked up the telephone at any time and called me. We could have hashed out whatever we needed to has out then and there. You've chosen to post minimal statements as "fact" that something sinister was in the works. Unfortunately, they don't support the truth. I can't see why we shouldn't be allowed to counter those "facts" with a few of my own, should be allowed. Quote:
My only hope is now that all the cards are on the table, you'll either realize that I'm not "out to get you" and that we can put this behind us and go back to enjoying the site as it was meant to be enjoyed? |
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I just wanted to clear up this error you have expressed. I'm still reading the rest of your novel. :rolleyes: |
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