Laser jammers

Prestige593 said:

MYTH #1 : Driving 25 miles over the posted speed limit IS NOT reckless driving according to Florida State Statute.

316.192 - 1)(a) Any person who drives any vehicle in willful or wanton disregard for the safety of persons or property is guilty of reckless driving.

No where does it state that excessive speed is reckless. If you received a citaion for reckless driving, and you were "ONLY" travelling 25 (+) M.P.H. over the posted speed than that citaion would be invalid. (example) If the excessive speed, accompanied with cutting around other vehicles, on wet roads, where pedestrians were present that is another story.

Speeding is one of the most prevalent factors contributing to traffic crashes. The economic cost to society of speeding-related crashes is estimated by NHTSA to be $40.4 BILLION per year. In 2005, speeding was a contributing factor in 30 percent of all fatal crashes, and 13,113 lives were lost in speeding-related crashes.
-NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration

I have been a Police Officer for 12 yrs in a large city, I am not pulling this information out of my @ss. I do know that laser jammers are a waste of money and do NOT work. Remember in the late 80's early 90's the "Radar absorbing bra"? How short lived was that! And yes, HeelnToe you have to pay to play (and that goes for me too, yes there are cops who write other cops tickets out there). For the rest of you, If you get caught speeding then take your licks. My advice to you is not to argue w/ the officer (or worse Trooper), just accept the citaion and drive off. Trust me, you wont win the argument and may just piss him/her off to write more citations. Your best bet (at least in Broward county) is to hire a ticket attorney, or go to court yourself.

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I couldn't have said it better myself Prestige. I think you hit all the valid points regarding speed vs reckless driving. SPEED IN AND OF ITSELF IS NOT RECKLESS DRIVING.

As an Officer of 10 years I can say that I have given reckless driving tickets for things such as donuts being spun in an intersection based on traffic and peds in the area, and have written 100-plus mph speeding tickets with not so much as a "please slow down" and off the driver went with no reckless driving charge. The only catch now is that the law is such that 30-plus over the limit is an automatic court date. The court date is STILL AN INFRACTION, which means NO CRIME (ie reckless driving is a CRIME). The court date is only to prevent the violator from simply paying or taking the online drivers course without the inconvenience of having to look remorseful in front of a judge. The law makers wanted the high speed violations to be troubled to loose time and physically appear in court. The fines and or punishments are the same. The judge can ding the driver a higher fine or even suspend the license a few weeks if the behavior keeps repeating itself.

I know I don't ticket until the driver hits 20 mph over the limit on major roads, and 15 in slower residential areas with pedestrians about. Some officers start at 15 over on major roads though, so keep it within 10 of the limit and 95% of the officers won't bother you.

If you do get stopped please don't insult the officer and say "Well gee officer, I really don't know why your stopping me" because then they feel that you might have to be reminded in a more permanent way if you were really that unaware of what you were doing. I have let many people off for simply appearing remorseful and willing to take the lumps. If I think that they truly are sorry then I feel the ticket is not necessary.

Believe it or not I am no hypocrite, and have actually managed to get both cars stopped when I see some silly behavior (ie red light to red light at 3am) and given a lecture and stopped at that. If the car runs then the one that stopped is home free and the runner is "game on" go straight to jail-do not pass go-do not collect $200.00!

That is some good and encouraging info from Prestige and Hot Pursuit. I'm glad there is mostly reasonableness in the LEO community. You guys have an incredible amount of responsibility and risk involved in your day to day. I applaud your getting involved in these forums.

Including commutes, I've taken at least 50,000 trips in my lifetime (including two 10k mile cross-country trips). Virtually always 10-14MPH over on highways, 5-9 MPH over on local roads and have about a dozen tickets lifetime, so it is actually a very low percentage. I read in the Florida drivers manual where either 4-5 MPH over the limit isn't even a ticket, only a warning? It is mostly on local roads where signs aren't always well posted where you can do 50-55 in a 25 or 30 zone (thinking it is a 45 zone) and get caught out. Now with 70MPH limits on FL highways, 80-85 is fast enough.

I guess we'll all just keep on keepin' on.

The way that I handle business is this: (Disclaimer - I cannot speak for any other police officer, only myself). I am radar and laser certified. When I am running radar or laser I give a grace of 20 M.P.H. That means that on a 50 M.P.H. roadway, the vehicle has to be at 70 or above. I think that that is fair.

To get back on track, I am telling you, as a fellow corvette owner (C3), please save your $$ and DO NOT buy any type of laser jammer or radar detector. Everything good that you hear about these products is propaganda and advertisements from companies that make them.

don't know if this matters or not but i have a jammer and everytime there is one of those sings on streets that tell you how fast you are going it jams it all up into a bunch of squiggliy lines, and also on the suncoast parkway with the radar and speed sign at the toll of waters (i think) it always jams that up quite nice. I would have to assume it works but don't put all of your trust into them. hope this helps. thanks mike

Does anyone know WHY radar jammers are illegal?

Rich Z said:

Does anyone know WHY radar jammers are illegal?

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because they jam the cops radars. isn't that illegal enough? That they can't tell how fast you are going when you are speeding.

03blackZ06 said:

because they jam the cops radars. isn't that illegal enough? That they can't tell how fast you are going when you are speeding.

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So why would that be against the law? Why should I be obligated to provide the evidence to be used against me as a revenue generating exercise? :reddevil:

Just playing the devil's advocate role here.....

Laser jammers are not illegal in Fl.

laser jammers are not illegal as they are regulated by the us. food and drug administration. There is no law that makes them illegal but you have to smart while using one. I currently use a park pro and my unit works absolutely flawless. I have been hit hundereds of times in the orlando area and I have never gotten nailed for speeding. When you use one it will alert you that your being shot with the laser beam. After adjusting your speed to the legal speed limit I turn my unit off the cop gets my speed and I keep riding. As far as a radar jammer, I have one of those as well and it only jams k band and it is not to reliable. I know it works cause when I go by one of those silly signs on the side of the road that tell me what my speed is, it displays nothing whatsoever. I bought my unit from a company years back for 700.00 and the company was called tigerlilly and it was named a phantom. Not rocky mountains junk. Passive radar jammers are a scam. They say they will pay your speeding ticket if you are using it when your stopped, but if you read the fine print thats given to you when you buy there crap it states they will only pay your ticket if it shows you were doing under 10 mph of the posted speed limit. A real joke cause most cops will give you up to 10 over anyways. Just a word from expensive and lived experience.


O yeah one other note: Just because this is my first post here does not mean I am spreading propoganda for anyone else or trying to sell anything. I could care less if you buy one or not. I am simply stating fact. And yes I do own a vette, its a 98 c-5. I usually drive my 87 grand national because it simply has more power and more grunt than my vette.:dancer01:

clipjoint said:

...O yeah one other note: Just because this is my first post here does not mean I am spreading propoganda for anyone else or trying to sell anything. I could care less if you buy one or not. I am simply stating fact. And yes I do own a vette, its a 98 c-5. I usually drive my 87 grand national because it simply has more power and more grunt than my vette.:dancer01:

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:wavey:And don't sweat the small stuff. And remember, it's all small stuff

If this were your 1st post, you had a location in, oh, lets say, Pakistan, Delhi, Brisbane (UK), etc., and at the end of a post that would likely make no sense, other than to include a couple of phrases (catch words) from the original post/thread, then ended with a link to Viagra, i-Pods, MP3's, Low Cost drugs, etc...then we'd be worried:lmao:

:welcome:to the site and enjoy. You ressurected an old thread, but that's why we keep them around:thumbsup:

Never know when some good or new information is going to hit the page.

Enjoy the site:thumbsup:

Oh, BTW. My son has an 87 GN that we're restoring. It would out run (not outhandle) my 87 vette any day of the week! Bad assed cars in the day...and a back seat to boot!:thumbsup::dancer01:

Prestige593 said:

MYTH #1 : .

No where does it state that excessive speed is reckless. If you received a citaion for reckless driving, and you were "ONLY" travelling 25 (+) M.P.H. over the posted speed than that citaion would be invalid. (example) If the excessive speed, accompanied with cutting around other vehicles, on wet roads, where pedestrians were present that is another story.

What about the new 30 over law? Didnt that make it criminal?

Speeding is one of the most prevalent factors contributing to traffic crashes. NHTSA (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration)

I respectfully disagree. Tailgating (little to no stopping time not only for the tailgaiting driver but also the driver behind the tailgater etc and etc that causes a chain reaction) and inattentive drivers (ie; cell phones etc.) are the biggest causes. And dont forget DUIs. I do not accept the validity of the NHTSA, they have their agnedas.

I have been a Police Officer for 12 yrs in a large city,

Thank you for your service, I am sure you have positively impacted many lives.

I am not pulling this information out of my @ss. I do know that laser jammers are a waste of money and do NOT work.

I had the blinder, it does work. sold for engine mods, was doing anygood sitting in a non running car, LOL

yes there are cops who write other cops tickets out there

Really? TPD (Tampa Police Department, Hillsborough) in their patrol cars who live in Pasco county when late for their shift are constantly hauling ass on the suncoast/veterans and pass FHP and they do nothing. Wish I had a free pass when I was late for work.

For the rest of you, If you get caught speeding then take your licks. My advice to you is not to argue w/ the officer (or worse Trooper), just accept the citaion and drive off. Trust me, you wont win the argument

I agree, you play sometimes you have have to pay.

and may just piss him/her off to write more citations.

This is disturbing

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Just some random responses

Brad,

The 30 over law made it a MANDATORY court appearance on the 1st violation (no options) but not criminal at that point.

Penalties of latter violations become progressively stiffer until it finally becomes criminal.

I agree that NHTSA has an agenda. Frankly, statistics can be skewed to give you (in most cases) the result you want.

Is speed a factor in most crashes?

Yes, but only because ANY speed above the POSTED LIMIT is a vioolation, and "may" have been a factor. The faster you go, the longer it takes to stop. If you're following too closely asn you mentioned then you need to slow down. So, even if the driver was doing the "posted limit", but was only 1 car length back, then "speed was a factor." See how easy that was to screw up the statistics

As for the effective ness of LASER or RADAR equipment, I've never owned a laser or radar dector or jammer so I really don't know?

Really? TPD (Tampa Police Department, Hillsborough) in their patrol cars who live in Pasco county when late for their shift are constantly hauling ass on the suncoast/veterans and pass FHP and they do nothing. Wish I had a free pass when I was late for work.

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This is a hot button for me!!

At the Sheriff's Office, as long as I was there, we had assigned cars. For years we had these moles from the insurance company that insured the Sheriff, who would randomly spot check us. They'd follow us to work or down the road for a distance and note or videotape our driving habits then report back to the department.

Believe me, you didn't want to get nailed by them over once!:rofl1:
They're gone now as far as I know.

And you definately didn't want to generate a citizens complaint.

I see the same thing you do on a daily basis, and frankly, it pisses me off!!!

The same officer that will likely in an hour, be out writing the general populace tickets for speed, is busting balls down the interstate, late for work. Worse yet, trying to get home:thumbsdown:

How do I know?

I've called:thumbsup:

It's easy enough to get the unit # of the patrol vehicle, the location and time and call the agency. They will tell you if the operator is on duty or off.

I had one so agregious, that I called and spoke with his supervisor. I always introduce myself (professionally), then make it clear that I don't want to initiate an IA complaint. I also make it clear that I do not wish any damage to the officers work record. Then I detail the action(s) I observed giving specifics (location, direction of travel, following distances, speed, etc.) In many cases, I'll set a speed and watch them pull away from me and use that as an indicator.

I make it clear that the reason I'm calling, is just because of what you mentioned above. THe PUBLIC's PERCEPTION!!

Think about it. It's rolling billboard for the agency.

The one in particular was coming south INTO the City of Tampa from Pasco County when I 1st encountered him. We were still several miles NORTH of the city limits.

He jumped on my a$$ and was less than 3 car lengths away at 70 MPH!!

I moved over thinking maybe, just maybe, he was a tactical member and on a call out? (try to give them the benefit of doubt).

I watched him tailgate several other vehicles, travel up to 85 mph, all the while outside the city and with no emergency equipment in operation!!

I followed him into the downtown area. He took a couple of irratic turns which made it obvious that he knew "someone" was watching. He headed off into the projects just north of the courthouse and I left him alone, once again, hoping that maybe, just maybe, he was headed to back up an officer! Rationally, it made no sense, but I was hoping.

A few minutes later, I saw him drive past the front of the Courthouse:lmao:

I called and left a message for his supervisor.

The Sgt. later called back and I gave him a complete descriptive account of the actions I observed, in a clear, concise and professinal manner, to including the turn into the projects and the courthouse driveby.

Sarge said he'd check into it and call me back.

Sure enough, about an hour later, I get a call back fromthe Sgt.

It seems the knucklehead was off duty that day, was headed to court and was late!!

The officer tried to tell the Sgt. that he was backing up an officer in the projects on a stolen vehicle. Problem was, the Sgt. was on scene and told him "that's funny, I never saw you and you were not checked out on radio at the scene

BUSTED!!

Sarge asked if I wanted to do something more "formal" and I declined. I told him that whatever he decided to do was sufficient and I'd leave it in his ever capable hands.:thumbsup:

Believe me, you can effect change, but you have to be willing and able to approach it professionally, as a concerned citizen and not a pissed off one, and with details.

Every now and then, the press gets involved and you see things slow down for a while. Unfortunately, some of these guys and gals feel they have the "free pass" as you mentioned.

I've gotten my share of breaks as a LEO and I won't deny that. Then again, I've given my share of breaks to the citizens as well.

and may just piss him/her off to write more citations.

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I agree that it's disturbing, but it's a fact of life. We're human too.

If you want to stand there and argure (and I've had people become pretty heated and graphic before) with me, there's not much I can do.

If it's not too aggregious, I can't put you in jail for disorderly.

If you don't touch me, I can't put you in jail for battery.

Department and CJSTC standards didctate certain codes of conduct which preclude me from agruing back with you on the side of the road.

That said, bitch slapping you back into reality, is certainly out of the question!:lmao:

So what options are left?

Ah yes...the safety check

Get comfortable, this may take a while:lmao:


Hope everyone had a safe and enjoyable Memorial Day weekend and remembered those who never returned

Later guys:wavey:


G~

Gordon,

Thanks for the reply, always good to hear from you.

No doubt cops have a difficult duty. They have to determine how one individual's actions impact the greater good of everyone else each and every time and get it right with no margin for error. And scrutiny of Monday morning quarterbacks is never any fun at all.

In a way it seems cops and teachers are both always caught in the middle and the only ones looking out for us in reality are fellow colleagues. We count on and trust each other. So as a teacher myself I completely understand the closed ranks mentality. What is sad is that some of our brothers don't comprehend how we are all perceived. How what we do and how we act in the public eye brings scrutiny to us ALL.

In closing I would say that in really thinking about the TPD thing, I could let it go and give them the leeway and understanding if I just felt that I ever got any type of returned empathy. That FHP would give me a warning after running my license and driver history, on the veterans and say, "you know I have been late myself once in a while and had to push it, be safe and here is a warning. Have a great day."

Peace

The bottom line is that it truly is a thankless job. We just try to leave "our" little corner of the world a little better than we found it....

85vette said:

The bottom line is that it truly is a thankless job. We just try to leave "our" little corner of the world a little better than we found it....

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Yep certainly thankless, and likely to get much more so. With the state pushing LEOs to become uniformed and armed mobile tax collectors for the state, people are going to be building up a lot of resentment over that. It's one thing to believe the cops are only doing a tough job because it is needed for the benefit of the public safety, but another ball of wax entirely when you get to feeling that to hell with safety, let's get out there and rake in some money from the civilians. And the state, seeing the money being raked in, then starts making more and more things as fined infractions, plus increasing the cost of those fines as well when budget shortfalls are expected.

So yeah, safety checks are now a financial windfall exercise. I guess I'm getting tired, like most other people, of having someone constantly trying to get a grip on my wallet over one pretense or another, no matter what it is. Yes, we need laws, and we need people to enforce those laws. But don't get us thinking that the laws are merely a pretense to collecting yet another form of tax from the public.

If cops want respect, they have to be doing a respectable job to be respected by the public for what they are doing. Having the public perceive them as wolves looking for sheep to fleece (figuratively speaking) just is not going to earn them the respect that the job SHOULD earn them.

And no, I'm not blaming cops for the job becoming what it is now headed for. But it's certainly going to be driving a much bigger wedge between them and us before too long.

I agree with you Rich. Police officers should garner the same respect from the populace as people in the military do. But with so many things being illegal for no other practical reason than to fine people (or so it would seem), I personally can't be around a cop without feeling like I'm near an enemy. I'm not even sure why, either... probably too much time spent in Dade county. :shrug01:

floridaZ said:

I agree with you Rich. Police officers should garner the same respect from the populace as people in the military do. But with so many things being illegal for no other practical reason than to fine people (or so it would seem), I personally can't be around a cop without feeling like I'm near an enemy. I'm not even sure why, either... probably too much time spent in Dade county. :shrug01:

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In my opinion, the problem with your theory of the officer being the enemy is that he is a troop, not a general or leader who dictates the pace of the war. Hate the war, not the soldier. They not only have a very tough job they are doing it with massive pay cuts and bills piling up like the rest of the world. They have the same financial stresses you have for your mortgage and bills, yet he has the added problem of people trying to kill him over the color of his shirt. If the officer isn't facing some hard core felon he is dealing with the drunks who kill them too when they veer towards the cruiser on the shoulder because they are mesmerized by the flashing lights. Then in the same day the officer may have to deal with a normal every day citizen who has some simple (yet world moving problem like a stolen credit card number) and still make as many people as happy as possible. The bottom line is they need that job, as big a pain as the job is, to feed their family and help make their portion of the world better for all by capturing the predators of society.

The officers as a whole (I understand there are bad apples in EVERY profession) really do the job to help, not hurt people. They are just following orders.I know speeding tickets suck, but what sane person would go out on the roads of ANY state if the police NEVER enforced traffic laws. I certainly would not go out there. It's crazy enough without the thought of a Mad Max scenario on the roads.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Rocket's right.

It's not all cops that are the problem. It's a few. Unfortunately, as we've seen here, it's those few we hear about.

And the "troop" analogy was right on target:thumbsup:

They don't "make" the policies, they simply try to enforce them. And as with any other job, if you don't do whats expected of you, you'll not get promoted and may not get retained as things are going recently.

And speaking of recent cuts, as I mentioned in another thread, there's absolutely NO REASON (can you hear idiots me Coats? Gee? Anyonter administrator that is having these thoughts?) to furlough, fire or WTF ever you want to call it, active, street level LEOS!!

Dumping the DUI squad was a good move:thumbsup:It was antiquated and ineffective for what it costs.

But to consider terminating street cops as long as we have massive spending, rediculous numbers of upper level managment and pay scales to accompany them:thumbsdown: is absolutely ludicrous.

This is an easy fix but you're going to have to quit whining like a school girl and want to fix the problem!

Anyway, back on topic, street cops just try to abide by the sometimes rediculous policies of thier administration. When stupid reared it's ugly head, we simply did as little as necessary to "look like" we were complying while having as minimal impact on the general populace as possible until they (the administration) got over it

Stay safe.

G

Z06 Rocket said:

The officers as a whole (I understand there are bad apples in EVERY profession) really do the job to help, not hurt people. They are just following orders.

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Exactly what I was getting at, but I just see too many things that I don't like at all. Like undercover cop cars, I can understand using them if you are doing surveillance, or busting a meth lab. I can even understand chasing a running car in one if the marked cars need the assistance. But using them for traffic enforcement quite frankly pisses me off. A marked car is much better at getting a lot of people to reduce speed. So if the goal is to get the tickets in and generate revenue, they are a great idea; but if you want to preach on about how they are there for public safety, I call BS. And they are the worst for doing their own traffic infractions too, since they know it's harder to get a tag number than to get a vehicle number. Like that asshole in the grey Charger.

I've seen times where the local PD parks their marked cruiser in a place where people speed (in a position that makes it look like a speed trap), and then walk off and go have lunch. It's amazing how many people do the speed limit when those guys are eating. :rofl1: We need more officers like that than the ones preying on the general populace in the unmarked cars.

Once the focus of law enforcement turned more towards revenue collection and actual public safety became a secondary focus, then the rules and perception changed for a lot of people. Traffic enforcement is just a form of tax collection these days, and people are beginning to resent it.

No one can truly appreciate the job a Law enforcement Officer does, except another LEO. The job is so broad, but the public usually only sees what is visible from behind the wheel of their car. Unless you are that person that has a prowler outside their house at 2 AM, or the parent of a teenager that has been killed in a traffic accident, or the guy whose stolen Four Wheeler we recovered last night, you probably only see us as the Jacka$$ with the ticket book who is going to cost you a bunch of money and make your insurance go up.
The truth is, most of us (I do say MOST) are just like you. We just have this crazy job with weird hours and have supervisors that tell us to do things that don't make much sense to us. But it's a job, and we were not drafted, we chose this lifestyle.
Where else can you get paid to speed on the streets and get away with it?
And I can park down the street from a bar at 2 AM and be accused of harrassing drunks!?! Contact your County Sheriff's Office and ask if you can participate in a "Ride Along" program. See what WE see, from behind the wheel of OUR car. The view is amazingly different!