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General BS forum I guess this will be for anything that would seem to be off topic in any other forum here. Just general shootin' the breeze kind of topics.

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Unread 10-23-2008, 04:18 PM   #1
Rich Z
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Default Obama and the attempt to destroy the Second Amendment

By David T. Hardy

Source: http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/obama-a...ond-amendment/

As a presidential candidate, Barack Obama must demonstrate executive experience, but he remains strangely silent about his eight years (1994-2002) as a director of the Joyce Foundation, a billion dollar tax-exempt organization. He has one obvious reason: during his time as director, Joyce Foundation spent millions creating and supporting anti-gun organizations.

There is another, less known, reason.

During Obama’s tenure, the Joyce Foundation board planned and implemented a program targeting the Supreme Court. The work began five years into Obama’s directorship, when the Foundation had experience in turning its millions into anti-gun “grassroots” organizations, but none at converting cash into legal scholarship.

The plan’s objective was bold: the judicial obliteration of the Second Amendment.

Joyce’s directors found a vulnerable point. When judges cannot rely upon past decisions, they sometimes turn to law review articles. Law reviews are impartial, and famed for meticulous cite-checking. They are also produced on a shoestring. Authors of articles receive no compensation; editors are law students who work for a tiny stipend.

In 1999, midway through Obama’s tenure, the Joyce board voted to grant the Chicago-Kent Law Review $84,000, a staggering sum by law review standards. The Review promptly published an issue in which all articles attacked the individual right view of the Second Amendment.

In a breach of law review custom, Chicago-Kent let an “outsider” serve as editor; he was Carl Bogus, a faculty member of a different law school. Bogus had a unique distinction: he had been a director of Handgun Control Inc. (today’s Brady Campaign), and was on the advisory board of the Joyce-funded Violence Policy Center.

Bogus solicited only articles hostile to the individual right view of the Second Amendment, offering authors $5,000 each. But word leaked out, and Prof. Randy Barnett of Boston University volunteered to write in defense of the individual right to arms. Bogus refused to allow him to write for the review, later explaining that “sometimes a more balanced debate is best served by an unbalanced symposium.” Prof. James Lindgren, a former Chicago-Kent faculty member, remembers that when Barnett sought an explanation he “was given conflicting reasons, but the opposition of the Joyce Foundation was one that surfaced at some time.” Joyce had bought a veto power over the review’s content.

Joyce Foundation apparently believed it held this power over the entire university. Glenn Reynolds later recalled that when he and two other professors were scheduled to discuss the Second Amendment on campus, Joyce’s staffers “objected strenuously” to their being allowed to speak, protesting that Joyce Foundation was being cheated by an “‘agenda of balance’ that was inconsistent with the Symposium’s purpose.” Joyce next bought up an issue of Fordham Law Review.

The plan worked smoothly. One court, in the course of ruling that there was no individual right to arms, cited the Chicago-Kent articles eight times. Then, in 2001, a federal Court of Appeals in Texas determined that the Second Amendment was an individual right.

The Joyce Foundation board (which still included Obama) responded by expanding its attack on the Second Amendment. Its next move came when Ohio State University announced it was establishing the “Second Amendment Research Center” as a thinktank headed by anti-individual-right historian Saul Cornell. Joyce put up no less than $400,000 to bankroll its creation. The grant was awarded at the board’s December 2002 meeting, Obama’s last function as a Joyce director. In reporting the grant, the OSU magazine Making History made clear that the purpose was to influence a future Supreme Court case:
“The effort is timely: a series of test cases - based on a new wave of scholarship, a recent decision by a federal Court of Appeals in Texas, and a revised Justice Department policy-are working their way through the courts. The litigants challenge the courts’ traditional reading of the Second Amendment as a protection of the states’ right to organize militia, asserting that the Amendment confers a much broader right for individuals to own guns. The United States Supreme Court is likely to resolve the debate within the next three to five years.”
(45:17-18; online link; slow).

The Center proceeded to generate articles denying the individual right to arms. The OSU connection also gave Joyce an academic money laundry. When it decided to buy an issue of the Stanford Law and Policy Review, it had a cover. Joyce handed OSU $125,000 for that purpose; all the law review editors knew was that OSU’s Foundation granted them that breathtaking sum, and a helpful Prof. Cornell volunteered to organize the issue. (The review was later sufficiently embarassed to publish an open letter on the affair).

The Joyce directorate’s plan almost succeeded. The individual rights view won out in the Heller Supreme Court appeal, but only by 5-4. The four dissenters were persuaded in part by Joyce-funded writings, down to relying on an article which misled them on critical historical documents.

Having lost that fight, Obama now claims he always held the individual rights view of the Second Amendment, and that he “respects the constitutional rights of Americans to bear arms.” But as a Joyce director, Obama was involved in a wealthy foundation’s attempt to manipulate the Supreme Court, buy legal scholarship, and obliterate the individual right to arms.

Voters who value the Constitution should ask whether someone who was party to that plan should be nominating future Supreme Court justices.
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Unread 10-23-2008, 06:48 PM   #2
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I don't know if I want to go ahead and send in my paperwork for my C/C permit or stay under the radar, just in case. If we have a liberal president and a liberal democratic led congress, look for an all out attack on the 2nd Amendment. I am betting on a steep tax to be levied on firearms sales and possibly a tax license on each individual firearm you own. That would provide the government with a huge tax base.

God Bless America.
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Unread 10-23-2008, 07:12 PM   #3
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Default Obama

We had to wait 20 minutes to get into the Tampa Gun Show this past weekend. Cash was flowing and the amount of guns and ammo seemed to flying out the door, was awesome. Not sure if people are buying now in fear of Obama, as his picture was every where at the show. Might be getting geared up for a revolution. I am buying as much ammo and firearms as I can along with several high cap mags for each weapon. The gun ranges are getting packed ,as the Wyoming club is very busy on the weekend. With illegals possibly getting benefits such as health care, drivers license's and social security, they may think that they can do what ever they want. Get your carry permit now, best $200 I ever spent. Teach your children safe firearm shooting. One day, saving your freedoms may be a family affair.
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Unread 10-23-2008, 07:36 PM   #4
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I've been putting off getting my permit, but am really thinking hard about doing it SOON! I don't want to be one of the thousands thinking about should, woulda, couldas!!

Seriously...what the phuck is the point of regulating gun control? The hard core honest remain honest, the semi-honest look for ways to become dis-honest (a little) and the already dis-honest find other ways of remaining dis-honest ...and now have more customers!!! DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
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Unread 10-23-2008, 07:40 PM   #5
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Think of the riots that may ensue if nobama looses.
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Unread 10-23-2008, 07:43 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ynkedad View Post
I've been putting off getting my permit, but am really thinking hard about doing it SOON! I don't want to be one of the thousands thinking about should, woulda, couldas!!

Seriously...what the phuck is the point of regulating gun control? The hard core honest remain honest, the semi-honest look for ways to become dis-honest (a little) and the already dis-honest find other ways of remaining dis-honest ...and now have more customers!!! DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
That's what I mean. The honest gun owners will payup.
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Unread 10-23-2008, 08:57 PM   #7
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I've thought long and hard about the gun rights issue and it all boils down to this: Why would the government want to disarm ME? The only reasonable answer I can come up with is "because someday they intend to require me to do something I really don't want to do, and they do NOT want me to have the ability to say NO."
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Unread 10-23-2008, 09:28 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Z View Post
I've thought long and hard about the gun rights issue and it all boils down to this: Why would the government want to disarm ME? The only reasonable answer I can come up with is "because someday they intend to require me to do something I really don't want to do, and they do NOT want me to have the ability to say NO."
Wasn't that Hiters plan?
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Unread 10-23-2008, 09:37 PM   #9
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Ok folks. Before we go out and loose our freakin' minds over this election crap, stop and think.

They only have 4 years.

Regardless of who wins, unless they are going to give us more of the same, it will take at least a year to a year and a half, for the president elect to get thier head out of thier ass, and start leading.

Even then, there's little he (or she) can do by themselves. They need the support of the congress to get anything major passed.

That said, by the time whomever, decides to try something as assignine as attempt to dismantle the constitution, thier term will be almost up.

If he get's too radical, he'll never make a 2nd term (by vote).

Same goes for McCain in the 1st term.

What I suspect will happen in the first term is:

-Housing will get shored up a bit.
-The economy will either stabilize or get a bit better.
-The job market will improve slightly.

and depending on the leader,

We'll either be out of the middle east, scaled way back, or going full tilt boogie to win it and end it!!

It's the 2nd term that scares the hell out of me!

Look back at the Bush administration.

He was the recipient of 9-11 Not much he could do. Sent us into combat under pretense.

In his 2nd term, he's gone completely nuts, spreading the military way too thin, pissing off every one he talks with, and throwing us deeper and deeper in debt


Watch what the incoming pres does in the first term, but...The second term....that's the one to look out for.
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Unread 10-23-2008, 10:49 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 98 softtail View Post
Think of the riots that may ensue if nobama looses.
I am not sure we are going to avoid it either way.
You know what happens in some cities when their sport team wins.
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