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Unread 04-27-2018, 05:15 PM   #2251
Rich Z
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 85vette View Post
Well that's disturbing.
What is disturbing?
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Unread 04-27-2018, 07:58 PM   #2252
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That your noise issue has gotten so bad. How many miles have you put on it since you got it "drivable"? I know it's been a while but I didn't think you drove it much. Does your drive shaft have u joints or CV joints?
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Unread 04-27-2018, 08:30 PM   #2253
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That your noise issue has gotten so bad. How many miles have you put on it since you got it "drivable"? I know it's been a while but I didn't think you drove it much.
Beats me, but you are right, it wasn't much. I think I only put 600 miles on the car last year. How many years has it been since I had the torque tube and clutch replaced? Maybe 3,000 miles all total?

Quote:
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Does your drive shaft have u joints or CV joints?
Neither. They actually call the drive shaft a "drive propeller". It is a one piece shaft contained within the torque tube that only has shock absorbing couplers that go between the propeller shaft and the rest of the drivetrain. One fore and one aft, if I remember correctly.

I had the entire torque tube replaced when it was at the local Chevy dealership. I had the TT couplers replaced with new ones, since it was a used torque tube assembly, but did not have the TT bearings replaced. They are a possible source of the drivetrain noise, of course.

I'm sure I have pics somewhere in this thread of the torque tube. When the car was at Chris Harwood's place, he put a Pfadt carbon fiber drive shaft in for me. Unfortunately, Pfadt sent him a shaft that was 7mm too long for the application, and caused all sorts of damage. Which is why Shane at the Chevy dealership had to replace so many components in the drivetrain. I'm thinking it may be possible that the input shaft bearing in the transmission may have gotten damaged too, when the driveshaft was flopping around in the torque tube. But that is something Greg would likely be able to determine for me.

One other reason I don't want to do this job myself is because I really don't know what the problem is, and am damn afraid I would have to just replace SOMETHING, and put it back together again to see if the noise went away. And if it didn't? Hell, take it apart and replace something else. Thanks, but NO thanks. I would rather have an expert who knows what he is doing do this job for me.
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Unread 04-27-2018, 09:27 PM   #2254
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That's right, I forgot they moved the transmission back to the differential. Yeah, I don't blame you. I would hate to have to do that job more than once. Good luck and let us know what it ends up being.
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Unread 04-28-2018, 05:49 PM   #2255
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i don't always fix my stuff either. whatever the outcome, hope it won't be too costly
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Unread 06-23-2018, 11:08 AM   #2256
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Well, honestly, I am about ready to give up on Greg Lovell at AntiVenom. I have sent multiple emails and even tried to contact him through his Facebook page asking about when he might be able to take my car in to work on it. No responses whatsoever. So I'm beginning to think he is just blowing me off and I need to look elsewhere for help.

Yeah, I know I should try calling him on the phone, but after the history of shops I have gone through with this car, I learned to try to get everything in writing of some sort. You just never know how things are going to go and you may really want to refer back to what was actually "said".

Anyway, I haven't driven the car for a while now, so this is getting to be pretty aggravating.

I sent an email to the Trans Am Depot outfit out near the airport to see if by chance they did general maintenance and repair work on other vehicles, but I don't have high hopes for that. And I also contacted Mike Carnahan of Vengeance Racing up in Cumming Georgia to see about maybe transporting the car up there. I'm thinking transporting it rather than driving it through Atlanta might be a wise idea. Depends on the cost, I guess. But I checked out Vengeance Racing and they seem to be highly regarded in the reviews I have read.

Also might consider taking the car back to the local Chevy dealership and see if I can get Shane (who is now the service manager there) to take a look at the car and figure out what I am dealing with. Not sure I would want to do a "let's just take it apart and see what we can find" sort of diagnosis there, however. But we'll see, I guess.

I would have liked to taken the car to Greg, but I am damned sight not going to chase someone down and wrestle them to the ground to try to give them my business. Unfortunate, but apparently his choice in how he does business.
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Unread 06-23-2018, 12:24 PM   #2257
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Rich, I have been in business 36 years, and found trying to follow up, or fix someone elses mess , never works in my favor. I wish I could help you come up with a solution, but don't have a clue where to start, other than put a for sale on that puppy.
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Unread 06-23-2018, 01:13 PM   #2258
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Nearly all of the messes caused by Harwood and Scott have been fixed at this point. All that remains, that I know of anyway, is that drivetrain noise. Just seems that it would be foolish of me to give up now without at least taking a stab at getting this one remaining problem resolved.

Honestly, the car is a pleasure to drive and gives you white knuckles when you push it. And for all I know I could drive it thousands of more miles with nothing more than that aggravating noise without having something just outright fail in the drivetrain. I mean, I have had that noise ever since I got the car back from Aaron Scott, sometimes worse than others. But honestly I couldn't swear it was the SAME noise the entire time. Since that time, the flywheel, clutch, pilot bearing, throwout bearing and slave cylinder, torque tube and driveshaft, have all been replaced. But Murphy's Law can be a SOB sometimes. I have to admit that it is not impossible that the torque tube that was replaced had a bad bearing in it, caused by that Pfadt driveshaft, making noise, and the one put in at the Chevy dealership (which was a used unit) has the same sort of problem. It happens. Lord knows I have had my share of computer trouble shooting where I would put in a board or component that had the same problem as the one I pulled out. Drives you nuts, but it does happen.

I'm not asking anyone to take on anyone else's messes. I have a car with a drivetrain noise that I want to have fixed. Something is making the noise, and I need that something to be either repaired or replaced. Surely someone is capable and competent enough to do that? Or at least competent enough to be able to TELL me what the problem actually is?
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Unread 06-25-2018, 10:42 AM   #2259
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I was browsing around on CorvetteForum last night, and found a thread from a guy apparently having some clutch noise problems. He took some short videos with an audio track which makes the noise pretty evident if you cut back the bass on your speakers.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgBXK9GHZD4




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_XM8qdnvoU

Then I went back and found a video I did a while back showing the noise I have been having in my drivetrain.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZabRgZ4fvrw

Sounds similar to me, except mine is much louder, likely because I have a remote microphone right up near the bell housing, and the other videos have the audio feed from within the passenger cabin.

I've reached out to the guy who made the thread on CorvetteForum to see what, if any, resolution was made concerning that noise. I also contacted a representative of Monster Clutches to see what they might think of the noise I am having.

It just might well be that the Centerforce clutch in my car has been the problem all along. I read that they are known for being noisy, at least as noted by some people. So that is the way I am leaning.

I am sending out feelers now to see who I can have work on the car. I would really like to get this resolved so I can drive the car without feeling like that noise is finally going to develop into something breaking, leaving drivetrain parts laying all in the road behind me.
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Unread 06-27-2018, 03:45 PM   #2260
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I'm still trying to get my mind straight about what potentially could be causing this drivetrain noise I'm having, so I decided to set up a chart that would show me what parts are rotating and which ones are not under particular circumstances.



The idea being that likely the noise I am hearing is coming from a part that is rotating pressed against a part that is not rotating. Or in a transition stage from a rotating part pressed against a non-rotating part to make the non-rotating part rotate.

In my case, the noise is most prevalent, although intermittent, when the car begins to move from a dead stop with me lifting up on the clutch pedal which brings the clutch pressure plate in contact with the clutch disk and presses it against the flywheel. A complication here is that it seems that the drivetrain has to actually be under load for that noise to appear. Working the clutch while the transmission is out of gear never seems to make the noise appear, whether the car is moving or not. In the video I did earlier, just the load of applying force to the rear wheels seemed sufficient to make the noise evident. Sometimes.

So there appears to be several components that are mechanically tied together and act as one concerning their rotation.

They are:
  1. Pilot bearing, flywheel, and clutch pressure plate.
  2. Clutch disk, torque tube input shaft, torque tube driveshaft, torque tube output shaft, and transmission input shaft
  3. Throwout bearing
  4. Transmission output shaft, differential, rear wheels

#1 is tied to engine speed. If the engine is running, those parts are rotating.

#2 is tied together as a single unit, effectively. If one part is rotating, they are all rotating.

#3 is only rotating when the clutch pedal is down, pressing it against the fingers of the rotating clutch pressure plate.

#4 is only rotating if the car is actually in motion, as they are tied to the rear wheels. So if the car is moving, they are all moving.

So the three conditions to be considered with all these moving parts are:
  1. Is the car moving or stationary?
  2. Is the transmission in gear or not in gear?
  3. Is the clutch pedal up or down?


So when I am hearing the drivetrain noise, the car is stationary, the transmission is in gear, and I am in the process of lifting up on the clutch pedal to bring the clutch pressure plate against the clutch disk, which begins to impart rotational energy through the torque tube input shaft, through the driveshaft to the torque tube output shaft, into the transmission input shaft, through the transmission output shaft to the differential, and then to the rear wheels.

Until I begin to release pressure on the clutch pedal to engage the clutch pressure plate against the clutch disk, there is no noticeable noise anywhere that I have noticed. When the car is sitting still in idle with the clutch pressed down, transmission in gear or out of gear, there is no noise. When the clutch pedal is fully released in the up position with the transmission out of gear and the car not moving, there is no noise. When the car is moving with the clutch pedal up or down, transmission in gear or out, there is no noise.

The ONLY time there is drivetrain noise is when the clutch pedal is in transition from being fully down to fully up with the transmission in gear. And sometimes I can hear a faint squeal and feel a shudder in the shifter during gear shifts. Again, highly intermittent, and only in the process of the clutch pedal being lifted after the gear shift change.

Today I took the car out to test an idea I had. What I wanted to do was to run the car up to speed, and then leaving the transmission in gear, let off the gas pedal to bring the engine speed down to idle, then push in the clutch pedal to disengage the clutch pressure plate from the clutch disk. Therefore the car's speed would actually be high, but the engine speed would be at idle. That would have the drive train from the clutch disk back to the rear wheels spinning rapidly, yet the pilot bearing, flywheel, and clutch pressure plate would be only at idle speed. The idea was that if the pilot bearing were bad, then in this condition, with the torque tube input shaft spinning rapidly, if the pilot bearing were shot, I would hear a clatter or squealing as the nose of the input shaft rattled around in the bad pilot bearing. However, no such noise was evident when I tried that. I tried it a couple of times, just to be sure. So much for that idea.

Of course, the drivetrain noise didn't show up the entire time I was driving the car, so I'm not sure I really proved anything. But I would think with a positive solid failure of any of the above listed components, the noise would be constant, and easily reproduced on demand.

So what does this all mean? What it likely means is that when I have someone else look at this, that drivetrain noise will not be able to be reproduced, and whoever is looking at it for me will think I'm some kind of nut with an imagined problem.

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