The ALL Florida Online Corvette Club








Corvette Top Sites

Go Back   The ALL Florida Online Corvette Club > Florida Specific Forums > Firearms and Other Weapons

      Photo Gallery Screen Saver!      

Firearms and Other Weapons Had a request for this forum, so here it is. Guess it will give me some place to talk about guns myself after selling my ArmsLocker forum.

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 02-12-2011, 05:32 PM   #41
Bob K
Deceased
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Posts: 1,268
Name : Bob Korreck
Bob K has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Z View Post
Be that all that it may, if I or anyone else is just walking through a Wildlife Management District, the only reason I can fathom a LEO demanding to do a pat down (ie: a SEARCH for weapons) if I have not given him or her any overt reason to fear for their safety around me, is that the LEO is just being a bonafide prick about it and abusing their "authority" (power).

It is my OPINION that Fourth Amendment of the Bill of Rights was penned exactly for the reason of trying to prevent this sort of abuse from happening to the citizens of this country.

Perhaps we just lost sight of what this thread was originally about.....
I see where you're coming from Rich but the courts have decided that there's a difference. I assumed it would be a 'search' but Gordon has explained the difference. Like you, I still don't like it but the officer would have to justify his actions.

If either of us were in their shoes I think our opinions would be different. Besides, if we're not pricks or haven't given them a reason to suspect we might be violating the law we're not going to have a problem cause we won't be frisked.

This thread has been a learning experience.
Bob K is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 08:30 AM   #42
C6Flatfoot
Member
 
C6Flatfoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Cape Canaveral
Posts: 71
Name :
C6Flatfoot has disabled reputation
Default

This has been a really good thread , with some good research and valid points that kinda morphed into different areas about carrying concealed.

I wanted to throw out a couple of thoughts I had, and they are in no particular order.

If we carry concealed wether as an off duty LEO, a retired LEO or as a licensed civilian, the key factor, in my mind, is to make sure that your gun is CONCEALED! If it is not, you stand a good chance of being reported to the police by a concerned or scared citizen ( everyone has a cell phone! ) and you then put a responding officer on the spot! You will be patted down, probably while proned out until you can assure the officer that you are a good guy! And you may still have some consequences to face.
Take a look at yourself in the mirror if you think that maybe the outline of your gun is visible in your pocket, waistband, or whatever, and make necessary changes before you leave the house.

When I'm off duty and out of my jurisdiction, I'm going to be a good witness to almost any crime I see.

Some good points were mentioned in the thread about when anyone should display or use a gun and I think we all realize that the gun only comes out to save a life..... PERIOD!

If we are in a situation where the gun does come out, or God forbid, used, REMEMBER....any responding LEO's rolling up on a scene are not going to know that you are a good guy. Follow their instructions to the letter! Have your credentials with you!

Carrying is a huge responsibility none of us can take it lightly no matter how long we've been doing it.

I apologize if this post makes me come across as a "know it all" or self proclaimed "expert", as I am neither. I have been a certified Police Firearms Instructor since 1978 and this subject matter has always been important to me.

Again, just a few extra thoughts for a really good thread.
C6Flatfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 09:38 AM   #43
Bob K
Deceased
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Posts: 1,268
Name : Bob Korreck
Bob K has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by C6Flatfoot View Post
If we carry concealed wether as an off duty LEO, a retired LEO or as a licensed civilian, the key factor, in my mind, is to make sure that your gun is CONCEALED!

Again, just a few extra thoughts for a really good thread.
We need and I value information from folks with real life experience, especially from LEO's, retired or active.

I know if my weapon is detected I may be in trouble. Does that apply to off duty or retired LEO's?
Bob K is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 01:32 PM   #44
jpee
jpee
 
jpee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Somers NY
Posts: 17
Name :
jpee has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob K View Post
I know if my weapon is detected I may be in trouble. Does that apply to off duty or retired LEO's?
Bob.. I think "Yes it would" ....."BUT" to a much lesser extent...as long as the off duty LEO or retired LEO was not being an A** Hole, drunk, or doing something stupid.... you know what I mean...

Using my experience on the GSP when I was pulled over, I showed my ID and told the trooper I had a gun in the car, no problem as everything else was in order, and yes I was speeding (about 80ish in a 65..

I bet if I were going 100+ he WOULD have checked a lot further, and maybe even took some type of enforcement action... ???
jpee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 01:50 PM   #45
Bob K
Deceased
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Posts: 1,268
Name : Bob Korreck
Bob K has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpee View Post
Bob.. I think "Yes it would" ....."BUT" to a much lesser extent...as long as the off duty LEO or retired LEO was not being an A** Hole, drunk, or doing something stupid.... you know what I mean...

Using my experience on the GSP when I was pulled over, I showed my ID and told the trooper I had a gun in the car, no problem as everything else was in order, and yes I was speeding (about 80ish in a 65..

I bet if I were going 100+ he WOULD have checked a lot further, and maybe even took some type of enforcement action... ???
Don't you remember the ticket I got? He followed me in a unmarked car at 100 MPH but wrote me up for 80. Thanks for the reply to my question.
Bob K is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 02:41 PM   #46
Rich Z
Internet Sanitation Engineer
 
Rich Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Crawfordville, FL
Posts: 15,123
Name : Rich Zuchowski
Rich Z will become famous soon enoughRich Z will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpee View Post
Bob.. I think "Yes it would" ....."BUT" to a much lesser extent...as long as the off duty LEO or retired LEO was not being an A** Hole, drunk, or doing something stupid.... you know what I mean...

Using my experience on the GSP when I was pulled over, I showed my ID and told the trooper I had a gun in the car, no problem as everything else was in order, and yes I was speeding (about 80ish in a 65..

I bet if I were going 100+ he WOULD have checked a lot further, and maybe even took some type of enforcement action... ???
Well, this of course, brings up the question of why any ex or off duty LEO would be treated any differently than any other citizen when caught breaking the law.

Professional courtesy? What exactly is that?
__________________
Rich Z is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 03:44 PM   #47
jpee
jpee
 
jpee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Somers NY
Posts: 17
Name :
jpee has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Z View Post
Well, this of course, brings up the question of why any ex or off duty LEO would be treated any differently than any other citizen when caught breaking the law.

Professional courtesy? What exactly is that?
What kind of work do you do? For example lets say you were a dentist, and needed a filling, and the Dentist who worked in the same building was going to do the filling, ya think he might charge you less than he'd charge me ???

Or if you were a barber, do you think you could get a haircut for less than I'd pay....??

If you answer NO to both of these, I'd bet you were not liked very much in the business..... just a thought.....

Do you think a waitress pays less for dinner at her place of employment...

ALSO if you were a LEO and stopped a car, and two big gorillas got out and jumped you... and was using you to mop up the pavement, ya think you would appreciate it if "I" stopped and pulled my Glock out and "Strongly Suggested" they STOP or they would be breathing through the top of their head...

You get the point....I have a video (taken from the cars dash camera) where a Va. State Trooper was getting his A** kicked by a 6'8 340 lb gorilla.... an off duty cop from NJ stopped and shot the attacker (who had a 38 cal. revolver also!!

So YES when I was on duty I would give "Professional Courtesy" to other LEO... maybe if he was drunk and totally out of control, it would be different, but I was never in that situation...
jpee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 06:37 PM   #48
Rich Z
Internet Sanitation Engineer
 
Rich Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Crawfordville, FL
Posts: 15,123
Name : Rich Zuchowski
Rich Z will become famous soon enoughRich Z will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpee View Post
What kind of work do you do? For example lets say you were a dentist, and needed a filling, and the Dentist who worked in the same building was going to do the filling, ya think he might charge you less than he'd charge me ???

Or if you were a barber, do you think you could get a haircut for less than I'd pay....??

If you answer NO to both of these, I'd bet you were not liked very much in the business..... just a thought.....

Do you think a waitress pays less for dinner at her place of employment...

ALSO if you were a LEO and stopped a car, and two big gorillas got out and jumped you... and was using you to mop up the pavement, ya think you would appreciate it if "I" stopped and pulled my Glock out and "Strongly Suggested" they STOP or they would be breathing through the top of their head...

You get the point....I have a video (taken from the cars dash camera) where a Va. State Trooper was getting his A** kicked by a 6'8 340 lb gorilla.... an off duty cop from NJ stopped and shot the attacker (who had a 38 cal. revolver also!!

So YES when I was on duty I would give "Professional Courtesy" to other LEO... maybe if he was drunk and totally out of control, it would be different, but I was never in that situation...
In any of your examples (dentist, waitress, barber), were any of those people caught breaking the law by the other members of those professions?
__________________
Rich Z is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 07:02 PM   #49
jpee
jpee
 
jpee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Somers NY
Posts: 17
Name :
jpee has disabled reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Z View Post
In any of your examples (dentist, waitress, barber), were any of those people caught breaking the law by the other members of those professions?
Doesn't make any difference... as a LEO the Officer has the discretion as to what he wants to do.. i.e. give a "Verbal warning, or a "Written Warning" or write a summons if "Deemed Necessary"

If a NJ Trooper pulled me over of 80 in a 65 zone and thought a "Verbal Warning" would suffice, thats all he is "REQUIRED" to do... if he thought I deserved a "Summons" he would/could do so....

In your case....with your "attitude" I can see INSTANT SUMMONS but that is only IMO.... another LEO say Bob K (if he were a LEO) might see fit to let you go with just a verbal warning...

So you see its up to the individual LEO as to what action he/she wants to take!!

As they said on "NYPD Blue" ... "Lets Be Careful Out There" Some of us have to be more careful than others because of the "Impression" they give to the LEO who stopped them.....
jpee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2011, 07:08 PM   #50
Rich Z
Internet Sanitation Engineer
 
Rich Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Crawfordville, FL
Posts: 15,123
Name : Rich Zuchowski
Rich Z will become famous soon enoughRich Z will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpee View Post
Doesn't make any difference... as a LEO the Officer has the discretion as to what he wants to do.. i.e. give a "Verbal warning, or a "Written Warning" or write a summons if "Deemed Necessary"

If a NJ Trooper pulled me over of 80 in a 65 zone and thought a "Verbal Warning" would suffice, thats all he is "REQUIRED" to do... if he thought I deserved a "Summons" he would/could do so....

In your case....with your "attitude" I can see INSTANT SUMMONS but that is only IMO.... another LEO say Bob K (if he were a LEO) might see fit to let you go with just a verbal warning...

So you see its up to the individual LEO as to what action he/she wants to take!!

As they said on "NYPD Blue" ... "Lets Be Careful Out There" Some of us have to be more careful than others because of the "Impression" they give to the LEO who stopped them.....
So you are stating that it is perfectly OK for LEOs to treat non-LEOs differently from LEOs in the performance of their duties? That the laws being broken by LEOs should be treated differently than the same laws being broken by regular citizens? In effect, "do as we tell you to do, not as WE can get away with."?

And you wonder why LEOs have issues with the public's perceptions of them?
__________________
Rich Z is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Central Florida Business Owner Launches Bucket List Hiking Club for Stressed-Out Exec RSS Feed Florida News Feeds 0 01-06-2011 07:12 AM
Boy Scout dies while on hiking the Florida Trail RSS Feed Florida News Feeds 0 05-11-2009 12:00 PM
Florida Governor Declares February Hiking Trails Month RSS Feed Florida News Feeds 0 02-06-2009 11:54 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:39 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Page generated in 0.07375097 seconds with 13 queries
All material copyrighted by CorvetteFlorida.com and
the respective owners of the material posted.