new kid on the block, griping already!

Hi folks, I have a 1985 Vette and am slowly getting her in daily driver form. I knew it needed a water pump so, smart me, I get upper and lower hoses and a Cloyes timing gear and set, aftermarket water pump,you know, kill two birds with one stone. After looking it over I have determined I don't have all the tools needed to do the job and have solicited labor estimates from a couple of local shops. They're telling me how you have to put it on a lift and remove the steering rack, etc., etc. $587.00 just for labor?!? I'm thinkin, this sounds a bit high, so I call the local Chevy place (University Chev. in Tallahassee) and ask what the labor would be for this job? $330.00 Wow! Never thought a dealer would be lower than an independant, right? BUT......... There's a catch! The dealer won't install non-GM parts. So,rather than pay $250.00 more for labor, I have to pay $250.00 more for the GM parts! We just can't win!

There are some independent shops up here in Mass. that won't install customer purchased parts either! I don't know what their rational is for that decision, but them's the rules so I guess that we have to live by them.
Andy

navy2kcoupe said:

There are some independent shops up here in Mass. that won't install customer purchased parts either! I don't know what their rational is for that decision, but them's the rules so I guess that we have to live by them.
Andy

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The rationale behind that decision is because they want to make a profit on the parts as well as the labor. You don't think you get the parts at THEIR cost, now do you?

Rich Z said:

The rationale behind that decision is because they want to make a profit on the parts as well as the labor. You don't think you get the parts at THEIR cost, now do you?

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Nah! I remember being told that it had something to do with any warranty work that had to be done concerning the parts. The people THEY buy the parts from will honor warrantees on the parts, but if the shop installs YOUR part they don't know where it came from, and how good (or bad) it is. Left unsaid was the uplift in price from what THEY paid to what YOU pay. I guess that either point has some merit.:yesnod:
Andy :wavey:

I understand the reasoning behind their policy, I wouldn't expect them to warranty a part that didn't have GM on it. It's just frustrating that you can save some money on labor only to be charged the difference when you buy the parts. I was actually surprised the labor was as low as it is. I'll see if I can locate another shop that is in the same labor range, somebody must still be reasonable. Many shops see a Corvette and see dollar signs, I know, I used to be a service advisor at the old Bill Thomas Chevrolet in Tallahassee. Many of the mechanics would bump an estimate on Vettes. I guess they figured if someone has the money to buy one they can afford to pay extra to maintain one.

I am currently working with a national chain auto repair center and they have been very willing to allow me to bring in my own SS brake lines and A/C parts. They did take me to side and ask that I not discuss it in front of other customers because they are not suppose to use any part other than what they can obtain. They kinda opened the door when they couldn't get pre-bent brake lines for my '93 and I found them on the net.
Thrust me they make money on parts.:yesnod:

85vette,

I feel for ya man, I really do.:yesnod: and I agree with what's been said here on this thread, including your posts.

Me...I do believe i'd want the GM parts or better, for my high performance baby:yesnod: I for one wouldn't want someone to apply 2nd hand or "cheaper" parts on her. :NoNo: Like you, i'd shop around also. I'll bet you'll find middle ground somewhere, without sacrificing the integrity/performance of your Vette .:thumbsup:

That beng said, it doesn't stop at the Mechanic shops. Seems like when I have people coming to the house to give us an estimate for something, they take one look at the Two Vettes parked in the carport and... cha ching, the price just went UP! I guess they see $$ signs and like you said, if ya can afford a vette well.....

Good Luck!

~Ray:thumbsup:

Yeah.... I need to go to the dentist to get some work done, but really don't want to pull up there in a vette for the preliminaries. You can bet the estimate will be higher than if I drove up in the van.... I would expect this sort of thing can happen in many other instances where the price is flexible.

I know exactly what you mean, I had a tree service come to my house to give me an estimate on removing some old pine trees around the house, this was back in Janurary, I called them back to give me a different estimate on just removing the palmettos and clearing out for a fence, less than half the original job, but when the owner/sales guy say the corvette in the driveway, the cost almost doubled for about half the original job... needless to say I laughed and told the guy that he could take that estimate and visit the nearest port-o-potty...

Joe B.

ynkedad said:

I feel for ya man, I really do.:yesnod: and I agree with what's been said here on this thread, including your posts.

Me...I do believe i'd want the GM parts or better, for my high performance baby:yesnod: I for one wouldn't want someone to apply 2nd hand or "cheaper" parts on her. :NoNo: Like you, i'd shop around also. I'll bet you'll find middle ground somewhere, without sacrificing the integrity/performance of your Vette .:thumbsup:

That beng said, it doesn't stop at the Mechanic shops.



~Ray:thumbsup:

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I do try to get the best parts for the money, my timing set is a Cloyes tru-roller, I've used them in several other rods I've owned and never had a failure. But guess what your local Chevy dealers sometimes do? I've sold tune-ups on Vettes and priced out the factory plug wires only to have the parts dept. send out to the local parts house for a $39.00 set. That's why I don't work in that business anymore. Just because you bought it at a dealer doesn't ensure it's the best, but yes, I know where you're coming from.

Since I have been in the Automotive Service Business for 32 years I feel qualified to answer this question. Any Business needs a profit margin to break even and then make a profit. The name of the game is to make the most in the least amount of time that the market will bear. A parts mark up is added to a labor charge based on a Flat rate, straight time basis ,or a contract price. A well run Business knows how much per hour profit is necessary to survive. If you cut out the parts then the labor will need to be raised to overcome the loss. As far as a Customer bringing their own parts, there is a huge warranty problem. I have actually used a Customers parts and had an immediate failure of the part at installation. The Customer then claims that it was not installed properly and his part is brand new and couldn't possibly be bad. If the part is clearly defective the Customer still balks at having to pay double labor to replace it again. Now to satisfy the Customer, you have to wait for the customer to take the part back to who knows where while you do the labor for free while the Service Bay is tied up with his car. All this inconvenience and profit loss just so the Customer can save some money on their car. If The Shop installs a part supplied by the Shop, there is no question as to who pays for the parts and labor. It is like buying an insurance policy on the repair. Put yourself in the Shop Owners position and you will understand. No Business is there to see how much money they can save the Customer. They are only interested in gaining repeat customers and making a good living by doing just that. If they don't make a profit, they will not be there long, nor will any Business.

Hi guys, we're in a much better frame of mind today! I was just venting on my first post. Please allow me to clarify. I fully understand the economics of business. But I also have insight when I speak of certain unscrupulous individuals that I've had the displeasure of doing business with. I have no problem paying a reasonable and fair markup for any item. But just what constitutes reasonable and fair? From time to time I have to buy certain items from a dealership due to needing a "dealer only" item. At one point I had to have a Delco electric solonoid. I was only able to locate it at a certain dealer. I was quoted $52.XX and told they had only one in stock. Due to a commitment I had my wife stop by to pick it up. She was told they did NOT have it, but she could pay for it at the dealer and drive down to their "warehouse" and pick it up. She went to this "warehouse" (read parts house) to pick up the part and casually asked if she could have purchased the part from them and was told, yes, certainly. My wife asked how much it would cost and was given an out the door price of $23.XX.
I know I'm a little old school, but when I started in the automotive business back in the 70's, 15 to 25 percent was a usual and customary mark up. Later, in the 80's I was introduced to the "sliding scale" mark up. This is accomplished by taking an item cost factor of .01 to $9.99 and marking it up 400%. Items costing $10.00 to $19.99 would be marked up 200%, etc., etc. To my understanding this practice is still ongoing in certain dealers today. This is why there is such a broad dislike of dealerships among so many consumers. The dealers generally have the best trained technicians in the field and many of us don't mind paying a premium labor charge for the expertise, but the outrageous price of "genuine" dealer parts drives many consumers away. As I stated before, I've sold dealer parts to consumers, only to have the dept. replace the part with an obviously inferior aftermarket item yet still charge for the premium part.
Sorry to run on so long, I'm not disputing a business's right to make a profit, I just don't believe the unsuspecting consumers should be taken advantage of. So shop around folks, use the internet, it's a wonderful tool. I understand many of you want to keep your Vette all GM, and if I was doing a correct resto, or if my Vette was all original, I would too. To some of you, money is no object, and you don't need to shop around. And the dealers absolutely love you!

All of the above for dealers and markups. I own 2 harleys and it is the same across the board with them as well. Most dealers won't install parts that you do not purchase from them, wether it is GM or H-D or whatever.

irfgt said:

Since I have been in the Automotive Service Business for 32 years I feel qualified to answer this question. Any Business needs a profit margin to break even and then make a profit. The name of the game is to make the most in the least amount of time that the market will bear. A parts mark up is added to a labor charge based on a Flat rate, straight time basis ,or a contract price. A well run Business knows how much per hour profit is necessary to survive. If you cut out the parts then the labor will need to be raised to overcome the loss. As far as a Customer bringing their own parts, there is a huge warranty problem. I have actually used a Customers parts and had an immediate failure of the part at installation. The Customer then claims that it was not installed properly and his part is brand new and couldn't possibly be bad. If the part is clearly defective the Customer still balks at having to pay double labor to replace it again. Now to satisfy the Customer, you have to wait for the customer to take the part back to who knows where while you do the labor for free while the Service Bay is tied up with his car. All this inconvenience and profit loss just so the Customer can save some money on their car. If The Shop installs a part supplied by the Shop, there is no question as to who pays for the parts and labor. It is like buying an insurance policy on the repair. Put yourself in the Shop Owners position and you will understand. No Business is there to see how much money they can save the Customer. They are only interested in gaining repeat customers and making a good living by doing just that. If they don't make a profit, they will not be there long, nor will any Business.

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Good post... most people have no idea of what it takes to keep a shops doors open, and parts markup is a part of the business equation. As a consumer, you might not like it, but that's how it is...

When somebody comes in looking for me to install their parts, I politely inform them that when you buy your own parts, this assumes you have the facilities, tools and knowledge to also do your own labor. If it's their own catback system, certainly I'll install it, but the labor charged will reflect that, as I have overhead to consider. Catback exhausts are about the only customer supplied part I will install.

I'm both a Corvette enthusiast and a businessman. If I did the work "for the love of it", I wouldn't be in business to serve the public, as I would have no money to keep going.

I won't even go into the "would you sponsor my car?" thing.... :rofl1: