All Motor vs. FI

I know this is a pretty vague question, but what the heck - it could turn out to be a pretty large, informative thread.

What are your thoughts regarding all motor vs. forced induction in a Vette? I'm wondering what would be the best path in a C5 Z06 - turbo(s), supercharger, motor work.

Give me all you've got! :thumbsup:

I think the issue is what is EASIEST, not what is best. An car with an added 200 horsepower isn't going to care how it got that way. Can the lower end of the motor hold up? Can the rest of the parts in the drivetrain handle it? 200 horsepower is 200 horsepower, as far as those parts are concerned, no matter how you got it that way.

But I think of all the power adders I have been trying to understand, nitrous scares me the most. It seems easy to use, and may very well be the best way for some people, but for some reason I never even consider that as an option for me.

Actually all things considered for what I would want out of my car, the twin turbo chargers seen the BEST. Main reason is that it is generally a gentler system on the drivetrain since there is somewhat of a modest spooling up of the power. Superchargers have better low end, but the cost is it can be much harder on everything having that instant on power. I think you would need to be more careful of how you launch yourself to keep from breaking things if your tires get too sticky on you. Street tires will be the circuit breaker to keep you from breaking other things, so once you mount slicks, you need to be careful.

But heck, what do I know? I'm only going by what I have been reading feverishly, so I'm just offering my opinions of what I have gleaned from other people's mistakes. One thing a friend of mine said a while back, after he had sunk MAJOR MONEY into his Porsche, that really stuck in my mind, was "You know, now I really wish I had spent that money on other things.....". :thinkin:

But I know the attraction of HIGH PERFORMANCE and it's siren call....

well after boosting for 4 yrs, I promised I'll never drive an allmotor car ever again. the main difference I notice switching to all motor is the smoothness of the power. so the car didn't "feel" really that fast even though it maybe. As with turbo, when boost hits!, you know it hits. the disadvantage with this is it hits hard and fast which may be unpredictable to control in a rwd vehicle. But it diffinitely give it the advantage for fun factor.
Also with turbo, I like the adjustability of power. you can push another 200+ hp with the turn of a knob and couple fuel adjustments. another advantage, going home after day of work, just listening to the turbo spool, the blow off valve sneeze and knowing you can roast the tires if push that pedal another inch :thumbsup:
wow that brought back memories haha.

the main disadvantage would be cost. to keep the motor alive, you need monitor everything. your tuning setup has to be up to par. and dont cheap out. I use the fast, cheap, reliable theory for this,you can only pick two.

Rich Z said:

But I think of all the power adders I have been trying to understand, nitrous scares me the most. It seems easy to use, and may very well be the best way for some people, but for some reason I never even consider that as an option for me.

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I'm sure you've seen this video and explanation of a nitrous system gone bad. Wet or Dry nitrous....not for me. I'd much rather a supercharger or turbo.

http://www.spdkilz.com/video-audio/Video-Audio/Corvette/James'Z06.wmv

This is a tribute video to my friend (and President of my car club, Shocker Racing) James' 2001 Z06. He was at the track on 4-9-05 and we think his fuel pooled in his intake manifold and BOOM. BTW, he was using a window switch for his nitrous, and had the setup professionally installed. All that other BS you hear online is just that. This was a technical malfunction within the system.

I think the advice I heard that was most instructive was when someone said If you can't afford to replace everything that can break, DON'T heavily performance mod your car.

Bear in mind that GM built the car to specs based on what the designers felt was the power the engine would produce. Certainly some overbuilding of components for safety and reliability concerns, but costs would have kept that from being excessively the case. So in my opinion if you keep your mods modest, you will likely be OK. Start exceeding 50 percent over spec, then you are probably going to be really pushing it. Probably some things pushed to the breaking point.

So when you start thinking of the cost of a major mod like a supercharger, turbo charger, heads/cam, etc., you may want to set aside a breakage fund as well. Just in case........

Another piece of advice I read somewhere was that if you have to take out a loan to DO your major performance mod, don't do it. Otherwise you could have a broken car sitting in the driveway until you can scrape up enough money to fix it.

Not trying to be the downer here, just related thoughts that have all gone through my mind as I consider the same things you are. Yeah, I get all tingly about having a 600 rwhp vette too, but am I willing to pay the prices associated with it? :shrug01:

It really depends on how much power you want to make ,and it also depends on how much money you wants to spend.

You can get 400-450 rwhp just by doing a head and cam swap .(3-5k)
So i wouldnt use a power adder at that rwhp rating .

Anything over 500 rwhp and you will have to setup a forged motor and decide which of the evil power adders you want to use and build the motor acordingly , but you have to have a hp number in your mind to shoot for .

I wanted 500 rwhp n/a and 800-850 on the spray .

I run about 500 rwhp everyday and that will pretty much take care of 99% of the cars on the road that i run into and for the other 1% i open the bottles and spray up to a 350 shot taking me up to 850rwhp/900 rwtq .
Then i turn the bottles off and drive my car around n/a waiting for the next victim

Damn! How often do you have to replace your rear tires on that thing? :ack2:

bout twice a year or so

All things considered, I agree with most as far as nitrous goes. I do not feel safe with it and will never consider it an option. :NoNo:

If money was not a concern, I would go with a built bottom end and a twin turbo set up. (Money is always a factor...:hehehe: )

I will probably end up going with a supercharger, its cheaper than a turbo and probably more dependable than heads and a cam. All the cars that I have seen with heads and a cam are constantly in the shop for adjustments.
A supercharger offers the easiest bolt-on power adder and is pretty reliable......:thumbsup:

Hopefully this will help, this of course is my modest opinion....:yesnod:

The only problem with using Nitrous is Knowlage and most ppl dont take the time to read and understand how it works .

You can blow a motor just as fast with a turbo or supercharger .
Ive seen and heard of more turbo cars spiking lean and melting motors than nitrous cars .

I started spraying my car at 50k miles and it ran great right up to 106k
when i spun a rod bearing , so i switched out to the 408 .

Its all in the knowlage .

I've had nitrous cars before and while I like the increase it gives you (especially torque) there is one big drawback. It's not there all the time. You have to turn the bottle on to use it. Yes, you can install a remote bottle opener but you can't drive around all the time with it on or you'll damage the seals in the solenoids and have nitrous leaking into the motor when it's off. Not good.

I've got a lot of friends with Grand Nationals, some stock, some modded, but they all agree on one thing. Turbo cars can be hard to launch well consistently. Street racing can be a chore too. If the tires break loose, and they probably will, you have to pedal it, at which point you lose all your boost and have to spool up the turbo again. By this time, the race is over.

I think I'd definitely prefer either a S/C or a good H/C setup. You can get some good power to play with and it's there whenever you want it. Of course, whatever you decide to do you'll likely need deep pockets, before and after the fact.

NA here!



Even though I love the sound of FRC Tom's STS TT's spooling up.

Hmm...maybe I can record the sound and put it on a loud speaker:lmao: :lmao:

IVOZ06 said:

NA here!

Even though I love the sound of FRC Tom's STS TT's spooling up.

Hmm...maybe I can record the sound and put it on a loud speaker:lmao: :lmao:

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Very nice! You can't go wrong with that set up.:thumbsup:

Mark Dalton said:

Very nice! You can't go wrong with that set up.:thumbsup:

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IVO ,, now tell them how much money you spent on the motor , install and suporting mods ,,, hahahahaa

I got lucky in a way ,, my built 408 motor alone was right at 12k .

But as they say ,, you gota pay to play .
:hehehe:

hey ZoomZ
what are you logging/tuning with. I have an PLX wideband also, just wondering what system its intergrated to

I have a N/X Maximizer that im going to hook it into as soon as i get around to it .

Right now the PLX isnt hooked into anything , its just reading a/f .

IVOZ06 said:

Even though I love the sound of FRC Tom's STS TT's spooling up.

Hmm...maybe I can record the sound and put it on a loud speaker:lmao: :lmao:

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Try listening to the sound from behind him....going triple digits!!! :yesnod: :hehehe:

Glad I went FI.....if you can't afford to pay then don't play...once you up the power be prepared to upgrade other parts...so far so good for me but I know its only a matter of time....